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#ValueFlows (VF) built into AP that service physical economy will need to map the physical terrain to the instance terrain in some way. Apples, pies, and sharing trucks need physical proximity.

A ValueFlows Story about Pies

https://www.valueflo.ws/assets/ValueFlows-Story.pdf

Thinking about #TownSquare, #activitypub (AP), #mastodon, #ValueFlows (VF), and getting from current #predatorycapitalism to where?

One vision of "where" comes from a book titled "Ecotopia" by Ernest Callenbach originally published in 1975. It describes the SF Bay Area, specifically Redwood City, 25 years after Calif., Ore., and Wash., split from the US to create an ecologically sustainable society. Here's the wiki link: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ecotopia

Of course, there's also the vision of KSR in "The Ministry for the Future" (TMFTF) with a bit of an earlier view of the messy transition out of the extractive economy. One critique of the KSR book comes from here: https://www.currentaffairs.org/2021/01/the-ministry-for-the-future-or-do-authors-dream-of-electric-jeeps, which asks: "Who governs the many financial transactions that are supposed to take place on “YourLock?”" Where #YourLock correlates to some flavor of AP.

AP has a goal of using VF to enable the economic activity described in both books' view of where to go. Here's a story: https://www.valueflo.ws/assets/ValueFlows-Story.pdf

This is scratching around ideas.

@jerry

Is figuring out how to integrate #ValueFlows (VF) into instances using #ActivityPub on the #Fediverse development list somewhere?

You are definitely well-connected to the underpinnings of the Fediverse and probably know about planned direction.

Are there plans to make funding all the pieces of the Fediverse (bw, hw, sw, labor) more automatic and integrated into the signup?

I give funds to 2 instances, an infosec person, and ValueFlows dev for a total of $40.35/mo. PayPal and Patreon were easy to set up. It was really hard to figure out how to fund what I think is a critical piece of ensuring longevity of the Fedi-- distributing funds within. The #Bonfire instance gave me the link to VF. Really knowledgeable, involved people are working on VF. I'm not a Dev, but docs there look like it could serve Fedi fund distribution. https://hrea.io/

Are there other plans for making funding better integrated into the Fedi? IMO, systematic financing is the weakest link to a sustainable Fediverse.

@mastodonmigration @loshmi
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Spent my first few days around here trying to figure out a fair share "#subscription". Very few provide an idea of how much would help. sfba.social said about $1000/mo in cost to sustain service (excluding labor). Set up my $10.35/mo for ecosystem infrastructure there.

Knowing an ecosystem needs an immune system, decided to Patreon an infosec person on fedia.io at $10/mo.

An ecosystem also needs a way to move the energy source around the system. Spent some time trying to find where that might be in the #Fediverse. Patreon, Kofi and et al. seem to be the most prominent means at the moment. Found #Bonfire whose protocol includes the #ValueFlows vocabulary. AFAIK, this is closest to an energy transport system for the Fediverse. Maybe there are other vocabularies for creating a circulatory system in the Fediverse.

https://forum.holochain.org/ seems to be where deployments of ValueFlows are being worked (moved to #discord). Exploring more before setting up a subscription.

Ed: 2/3

@dcht00

Thanks for the connection, @douginamug

I recommend #valueflows in the #commoningsystem project (all the texts are unfortunately in german) and for me this is a communist perspective. Getting into VF is tough. I have a friend here in Graz and we meet occasionally to have a better understanding, but @adamgreenfield has a point in mentioning the enormous challenge in achieving a broader usage. But in the end, it may worth trying.

#Economics:
Anyone in my network interested to study & discuss #valueflows , especially from a communist perspective?
https://www.valueflo.ws/

I've been trying for a while to dive into this, but think I'll need somebody to go along for the ride :-)

A new #Fediverse Enhancement Proposal has been submitted for discussion and collecting feedback:

#FEP-d767: Extend #ActivityPub with #Valueflows

https://socialhub.activitypub.rocks/t/fep-d767-extend-activitypub-with-valueflows/3086

See also the https://valueflo.ws website.

@anders @atomicpoet my hope is that in part these tools will create the social and economic networks of the future. Friends of mine at http://bonfirenetworks.org/ are building one such tool!
#Bonfire #ActivityPub #Fediverse #Valueflows

@api this is an excellent enumeration & explanation of different ideologies that are driving #protocol / #standards work.
I am curious where you would place domain models like #Valueflows in all this. I think we do pretty well at community building and having use-cases drive the spec. But there is also something worth exploring about domain models in general- those are places where a lot of effort has already gone into useful (pragmatic) abstraction. https://www.valueflo.ws/

@50htz
Thanks for the mention.

> @bhaugen is front man for #ValueFlows, a vocabulary for modeling economic exchange.

I'm the one who hangs out in Fedi the most, but @lynnfoster is the maintainer and gets the credit..

And we focus it more on economic collaboration, altho it handles exchange as well. This is what it was designed for: https://write.as/economic-networks/coordinate-the-flows

@ntnsndr @gingerrroot @CaribenxMarciaX @bonfire @spritelyinst

@ntnsndr
1. There are hash tags used to signal admins - #FediBlockMeta and (#)FediBlock. These were started by @gingerrroot and @CaribenxMarciaX and there's some interest in making a website

2. @bhaugen is front man for #ValueFlows, a vocabulary for modeling economic exchange. @bonfire is an AP implementation committed to bringing ideas like that to the Fedi. @spritelyinst is a project targeted towards making Fedi a safer place, a prerequisite for operating games and hosting financial transactions

3. I've seen people here being quite, umm, 'explicit' about the types of markets not tolerated on Fedi. It could be more clear, though, which markets are supported. That is to say, we want people to be able to market their own labor but not labor that's been stolen by capital. Damn. Still emphasizing the negative

@mayfirst
Great to know the Organization is here, as well as particular friends. Keep on keeping on💚

So, what other orgs/projects to follow? Well . .
@SocialCoop + @Matt_Noyes @emi @anaulin
#meetcoop #commonshour + @mike_hales @Wtebbens @Anarcat
#valueflows + @bhaugen How about '@valueflows'?
@disco_coop + @Stacco
@bonfire

Where is '@Solidarity Economy Principles' @cheyenna ?

Mayfirst how about tagging some of your affiliate orgs who are fediverse?

It would be super cool to combine #valueflows, a vocabulary for the distributed economic networks of the next economy [1], with an object-capability like #goblins [2]. To a certain extent, I guess that's what #agoric is trying to do [3], although not with the same focus :)

[1] https://www.valueflo.ws/
[2] https://spritely.institute/goblins/
[3] agoric.com/

Students at the #Milwaukee School of Engineering used #Bonfire to develop a federated inventory extension to empower their regional #fablabs ecosystem. We're now helping them integrate with the latest Bonfire functionality (such as boundaries) and release it as an extension.
They plan to use it next year to track the transfer, consumption and production of resources across several schools 🚀
#circulareconomy #ecosystem #valueflows #learndeep #upcycle #builtWithBonfire

The coordination app is the first of many that's based on the http://valueflo.ws vocabulary for economic cooperation. We're also planning to interoperate with the various #ForgeFederation projects for using it as an issue tracker for FOSS projects.

#ValueFlows

@Janetgunter been talking about this with people alot lately and it's something closely related to the work of #OHN and maybe even #ValueFlows

collectively agreeing on a semantic standardized way to describe the needs and wants of people connected to physical objects could bring us closer to this dream.

Hey @bhaugen

this is about https://fabcity.hamburg and #valueflows FYI:

I am super happy to have met Taxi-Activist @ClemensG from Hamburg at #fedicamp – can explain backgrounds but in short, the above [DE] post reads:

“I would be very happy if we could create a decentralised, federated FOSS alternative to the crammed platform capitalists, for taxi drivers, Lieferando and Gorillaz bikers, pizza delivery drivers, etc.

The conversations before and at the first #Fedicamp were encouraging.”

@douginamug @bhaugen

Right now, I think the ,action-situation' in the figure is on an analytical ,knowledge'-level and what she calls ,interaction' is what #valueflows calls a ,process' - something, which is realized. And she called it ,Action-Situation' (Action-Arena) to distinct it from the "Interaction-Process". But this makes everything messy and I hate to work with it.

But I definitely could be wrong.

Bumped into #Valueflows again, now that I have some basic #economics knowledge it's even more interesting, especially the algorithms part:
https://www.valueflo.ws/algorithms/overview/

@nicksellen @bhaugen @theblockchainsocialist @douginamug @karrot

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... also use the VF-vocabulary, Karrot and this other project is able to "talk" with each other. On a human level it means, it is much easier to understand, what that other project is doing/is aiming for. And #valueflows hopefully gets this widespread acceptance. So it is not some kind of cryptoeconomics project itself, but the vocabulary could be used in one as it could be used in any other kind of distributed ecosystem.